On this episode John Kozicki (Michigan Rock School and RockSchoolProprietor.com) and Mandy York (Music Time of Milford) teach music school owners how to get free publicity. Newspapers, magazines, online outlets, and even TV news are regularly LOOKING for stories to cover. Knowing how to craft newsworthy stories, write effective press releases, build relationships with journalists, and use photos can increase your chances of coverage.
We also explain why publicity can be more valuable than paid ads for long-term credibility and visibility to build your music school. And the best part is that it doesn’t cost you a cent!
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Episode Transcript:
John Kozicki (00:01.457)
Welcome to Rock School, Proprietor Podcast. My name is Jon Kozicki.
Mandy York (00:06.742)
and I’m Mandi York.
John Kozicki (00:09.161)
Mandy, let me ask you, have you ever had your studio featured in a newspaper or maybe on TV or magazine or anything like that?
Mandy York (00:20.63)
You know, once long ago, this was in the beginning of my first three or four years, I had someone from the local paper come out and watch one of my classes and take photos. And they did it right up in the local paper. It was when we were collaborating with a local senior center or assisted living center. Yeah.
John Kozicki (00:33.269)
Mm-hmm.
John Kozicki (00:40.125)
Nice, nice. Do you remember what type of publication that was? Was it a local paper?
Mandy York (00:47.948)
Yeah, it was the local paper back when we had one. Unfortunately, we don’t. That was the Milford times community paper.
John Kozicki (00:51.691)
So yeah, the small like community paper. Yeah, yeah, okay. Right, right. Which yeah, it’s a bummer that there’s are fewer and far between these days. I think you know this, I used to work prior to opening a music school, one of the jobs that I had, I was a publicist. And part of my job was writing press releases and contacting
Mandy York (01:02.798)
for sure.
John Kozicki (01:21.449)
reporters and news outlets to try and get our clients featured on TV or in the paper, magazines, all those things. So I thought what we would talk about today is how to get coverage for your music studio in the paper or how to write a press release and talk about all that stuff. What do you think?
Mandy York (01:45.132)
Yes, I love this. that’s a great idea. And I’m anxious to learn from you because I am not good at this.
John Kozicki (01:52.585)
Well, yeah, and I will say it has been a long time since I worked as a publicist. And I’ll also say when I started as a publicist, there was no social media. I mean, maybe there was, but not like it is today. And there were more news outlets. There were more newspapers. There are more community magazines. So things have changed, certainly. But I still dust off my
Mandy York (02:12.856)
Yeah.
John Kozicki (02:21.771)
PR hat on occasion and write press releases for my studio. And I thought, you know what, this might be helpful for other studio owners. So the coverage that I’ve gotten for my studio, I’ve been in smaller community newspapers like the one you mentioned, larger papers like in our,
Michigan in Metro Detroit area. So been featured in the Detroit News and Free Press, some local entertainment magazines, and also on the local news, which is like, that’s kind of like the, that’s what you shoot for, right? That’s the big one you really hope for. Did you see any benefits when your studio was in that publication? Do you remember noticing any benefits or not?
Mandy York (03:08.93)
Right?
Mandy York (03:22.656)
Yeah, for sure. so there was more social media and so the publication went out and then they also, they post these articles online, right? And that’s really great because you get, you get a broader audience seeing your, your business and your presence on social media, more clicks, more likes, more sharing. So that was really cool. you know, our metrics that month when the article went out, we’re like way up.
John Kozicki (03:50.933)
You
Mandy York (03:52.993)
on social channels.
John Kozicki (03:53.535)
Yeah, I think it’s probably important to keep in mind that I generally think of this type of thing as marketing, not advertising, right? And I think there’s an important distinction to make for anyone who might not be as tuned into it because oftentimes when we’re running our businesses, maybe we launch a new
Mandy York (04:10.104)
Yeah.
John Kozicki (04:22.728)
a new class or something and we’re thinking like, I’ve got to get more people in this class. How can I get the word out? And that’s kind of like, yeah, possibly this route with publicity, but that’s more of an advertising thing, I think. And so when you get featured in a newspaper or a magazine or something like that, I think of that as more big picture marketing. That’s the long game.
not the short game. Yes, I think you’ll get some initial visibility, a little bit of a bump in visibility, but I also think that there’s gonna be more long-term gain with additional credibility for your studio and name recognition, because those things are going to live online forever. Improved SEO with
Mandy York (04:53.678)
Mm-hmm.
Mandy York (05:17.25)
Yeah.
John Kozicki (05:22.346)
links on new sites pointing back to your website. So those are all, think, big picture long-term positives. So I would caution anyone thinking about doing something like this, writing a press release in hopes of it being more of an advertising tactic, probably not the best approach.
Mandy York (05:45.327)
Yeah, that makes sense. And I mean, I don’t know what you think about this. I, think word of mouth is like the best thing for me, right? Word of mouth, like marketing. And to me, this kind of publicity is the ultimate word of mouth, right? It’s putting it out there and people start talking and seeing it more. Yeah. Different than advertising.
John Kozicki (05:47.295)
Yeah.
John Kozicki (05:54.717)
Yes.
John Kozicki (06:03.048)
Yeah.
Yes. I saw this place in the newspaper last week or didn’t I see this on a story shared in the community Facebook group or whatever? Yeah, exactly. That it kind of I think it yeah, it promotes the word of mouth. It promotes brand recognition. So all of that stuff is I think where the benefit is going to come in with this. All right. So talked about the benefits now.
Mandy York (06:10.188)
Yeah.
Mandy York (06:18.166)
Yeah, that recognition.
John Kozicki (06:36.572)
If you were to do this again, right? So it sounds like you’ve done it once. If you were to do it again, what questions do you have? Like if I’m playing like your publicist right now, Mandy.
Mandy York (06:41.678)
Yeah.
Mandy York (06:46.168)
Ha ha.
Mandy York (06:51.468)
Right. So I’ll tell you what I did because, and then what I want to know, I was doing what I thought was this really cool thing where I was taking, had my studio, but once a week I would take a class into the, assisted living senior center, you know, once a week and we do it, did a class there. And I just thought it was so cool and so unique and I thought people should know about it. So I wrote, you know, I kind of wrote a press release.
John Kozicki (07:15.178)
Yeah.
Mandy York (07:21.566)
If you could call it that, I don’t even remember how, how well written it was. And, like I said, there were more, we had a local paper back then and I sent it out to whatever context that I could find. I just searched online and found those contacts and sent that information out. And it wasn’t immediate, but I did get an email back and they asked when they could come in and, and do the thing now.
John Kozicki (07:25.812)
Mm-hmm.
John Kozicki (07:37.802)
Mm-hmm.
Mandy York (07:49.813)
I was motivated because I thought this was like really different and interesting, you know, something worth covering. Now, like, sure, I’m doing really great, wonderful things right now. Where do I start? What do I want to tell people? What do, what is in my press release? Hi, I’m, you know, I’m Miss Mandy. This is what I do. here’s why you should, you know,
John Kozicki (08:10.537)
Yes.
Mandy York (08:19.576)
cover our business? Where do you start?
John Kozicki (08:22.238)
Yes. Okay.
John Kozicki (08:28.938)
I’m having trouble with my connection right now. Sorry.
Mandy York (08:32.507)
sure, that’s all right.
John Kozicki (08:45.788)
Note to Aaron, this is where you’re have to do some editing. Whoops.
Mandy York (08:50.218)
John Kozicki (08:56.5)
Shoot, we might have like a total disaster right now.
Mandy York (09:01.44)
Really? no.
John Kozicki (09:04.776)
I maybe I just keep getting this spinning wheel that says trying to reconnect. Make sure you have a stable internet connection. But then like you’re hearing me right now, right?
Mandy York (09:10.722)
Weird.
Mandy York (09:14.473)
Yeah, everything looks perfectly fine on my side.
John Kozicki (09:23.05)
Okay. I’m just like, I’m reluctant to, okay. I’m reluctant to keep going because like, I would hate to record the rest of this and then it’s garbage, you know?
Mandy York (09:25.078)
and I say 99 % uploaded.
Mandy York (09:37.496)
Yeah, yeah, I would probably be perfect. And probably be our best episode ever. It wouldn’t work.
John Kozicki (09:42.538)
Okay, hold on one second here.
John Kozicki (09:53.458)
It’s like it’s not even it usually lets me pause. And it’s not even giving me the option to pause right now.
John Kozicki (10:10.642)
Okay, let me, I’m gonna stay right there. Let me try something real quick.
Mandy York (10:13.634)
Yeah, no sweat.
Mandy York (10:29.346)
Hmm.
John Kozicki (10:50.646)
Okay.
I know it switched us. It’s weird. All right. Well, let’s, it looks like everything’s okay now. So we’ll pick it up. So you had just asked.
Mandy York (10:54.04)
You’re on the wrong side.
This is weird.
Mandy York (11:07.938)
Yeah, think, I mean, my experience got out there, right? I can, I did that and now…
John Kozicki (11:14.029)
Mm-hmm.
Mandy York (11:19.224)
So where do I start, I right? Like I had something that I felt was newsworthy. Do you need, I mean, is that what you need? Or can you just write a generic press release? What is the content of that? Yeah.
John Kozicki (11:23.863)
Yes.
John Kozicki (11:38.499)
Great question. Yeah, yeah, you use the term newsworthy and I think that’s that’s sort of key. Like what is newsworthy, right? So things like I would say things like because yeah, you’re right. It’s not just enough to be like, hey, we’re this studio. This is what we do. Do you want to come write an article about us from? I mean,
Mandy York (12:03.64)
Yeah.
John Kozicki (12:06.797)
For better worse, like we work in the entertainment industry, right? We’re musicians. Is an audience going to be interested in just kind of a random story? As much as we think we’re great, right? Probably not. But you were doing something unique. And on top of that, you were involved in the community, right? So that’s more newsworthy than…
Mandy York (12:20.949)
Mm-hmm.
John Kozicki (12:34.808)
Hey, I’m the studio and I work with kids, right? So things in my mind that I think are always like, yes, write a press release for if you’re opening your studio, because then you’re a new business that’s coming into the community. If your studio is moving to a new, bigger location, write a press release for that. That’s like a big thing. That’s something new. Those would be great for
community newspapers, maybe community blogs, if you have community blogs in the area. I mentioned community involvement. That’s a big one. So one of the biggest features I got from iStudio was during COVID. And what we did at the time was with our band program, we were kind of stuck.
What could we do? We can’t get together and have band rehearsals. So I hatched this plan. We shifted everything online. And in these online band rehearsals that we were having, we taught the kids how to record at home. So they recorded their tracks and then they sent them back to us. And then we edited everything. We put out an entire album. And we also implemented a charitable aspect to that album. So when we released the album,
Mandy York (13:57.228)
Yeah.
John Kozicki (14:03.565)
people could buy it and a portion of proceeds went to charity. That is newsworthy, right? Because number one, everyone’s like during COVID, everyone’s like, what are we doing? How do we keep the kids engaged? How do we keep them from going nuts? How do we keep ourselves from going nuts, right? So this was a way that we were keeping the kids engaged. We set up this charitable aspect to it. So that’s feel good. That’s the type of stuff that.
the community sort of rallies around and was able to get on two of our Detroit news stations featured for that. that’s kind of one of those big examples where sort of put a lot of things together and it created a newsworthy story. Maybe if you have been nominated for or won some awards or
students winning some big competitions, that might be newsworthy, or if your studio is winning big competitions, things that are really setting your studio or your business apart from, you know, just kind of your everyday stuff. I mean, I know a couple of studios who do like really, really big charitable things, like traveling to other countries and raising money, that kind of stuff.
Mandy York (15:04.782)
Yeah.
Mandy York (15:18.179)
Mm-hmm.
John Kozicki (15:31.233)
be newsworthy. Does that kind of help give you some ideas?
Mandy York (15:35.947)
Yeah, definitely. Yep. Yeah, it makes me think, you know, I could have been doing more of this probably. I’ve hosted like charity, benefit concerts, you know, or maybe our, like our annual big concert in the park. I don’t know. Yeah, that makes sense. You have to have a reason before you start writing a press release. Got it.
John Kozicki (15:46.839)
Mm-hmm.
John Kozicki (15:57.955)
Yes, and keep in mind, there’s this term slow news day, right? So if it is a slow news day, meaning there’s not other big things going on in the news, well, then the chances of your press release or whatever you’re doing getting across the desk and a reporter or a journalist seeing it or an editor seeing it are a little bit higher.
Mandy York (16:05.922)
Mm-hmm
John Kozicki (16:26.052)
I was working in PR during 9-11 and that day we went home because my boss was like, there’s no way any of the news outlets are gonna cover any of our stuff right now. May as well go home. So that was a big news day, right? Clearly. So.
Mandy York (16:47.864)
the end.
Yeah.
John Kozicki (16:53.621)
There’s something to be said for I think persistence, right? But yeah, timing and like how big your event is. So then the next thing I would say is, and you kind of did this a little bit in your situation, which media outlets, right? You got to find the right media outlets. So for
Mandy York (16:58.638)
timing.
Mandy York (17:19.66)
Yes.
John Kozicki (17:23.069)
Us? I mean, this is an extreme example and I don’t think anyone would do this, but like take magazines for instance. There are a lot of different magazines with a lot of different focuses. It wouldn’t make any sense for us studio owners to send a press release to say like an outdoors magazine. You know what I mean? It’s just like, it’s not a good fit. It doesn’t make any sense. So identify.
Mandy York (17:46.414)
Yeah.
John Kozicki (17:52.545)
which media outlets would even consider featuring you, right? So for what we do, I always think about, well, obviously you’ve got potential, if there’s like music related columns or things like that, there’s potential there. In newspapers, you’re be thinking about lifestyle sections because of what we do would kind of fall under lifestyle.
Maybe business, if it’s related to your business moving into a new location or expanding or something like that. Mm-hmm, mm-hmm, yeah. Similarly on TV, right? So you’re gonna wanna identify which, it’s called a news desk, right? Like which news desk or which editor. So which department. You don’t wanna send.
Mandy York (18:28.686)
an award. Yeah, okay.
John Kozicki (18:47.296)
You want to send the appropriate information to the appropriate person or else it just won’t get eyes on it. So you might want to do some research identifying which reporters cover. It’s called a beat, right? Which recover which reporters cover the beat that you work in. So lifestyle or sometimes there’s segments for locations. And identify who.
Mandy York (18:54.594)
Yes.
Mandy York (19:13.656)
Yeah.
John Kozicki (19:15.907)
who are the journalists for that.
Mandy York (19:18.102)
Okay. That seems tricky to me. I mean, back when I did this, I, I just stayed hyper local. I didn’t, I sent it out to just a handful of, you know, local reporter email addresses that I could find. How, how do you find these things? Any tips on how to find this kind of contact information?
John Kozicki (19:20.759)
Okay.
John Kozicki (19:32.429)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
John Kozicki (19:41.025)
You’ve got like honestly, you’ve got to be in tune with the outlet that you’re targeting. Because if you don’t read the paper, then you’re not going to know what section would cover my business, right? You know, so I think you have to you have to read the paper or you have to like subscribe to the paper or whatever, or you have to watch the news so that you have an idea of who to target or maybe you subscribe to a specific.
Mandy York (19:46.583)
Okay.
Mandy York (19:54.286)
Who? Yeah.
John Kozicki (20:10.623)
local magazine. You have to understand in reading who they would be susceptible to cover also, if that makes sense.
Mandy York (20:19.96)
That makes sense. Yep. You have to do your homework. You can’t just go to the website of the Detroit Free Press necessarily. Okay.
John Kozicki (20:25.101)
Well, you can start there, right? You can go to the website and look for like contacts. But again, also reading columns and reading articles that are similar to what you do or what you’re pitching will give you insight into which reporters cover that beat and which reporters would cover this type of story.
Mandy York (20:45.667)
Yes.
Cause you’ll probably be more successful if you can really narrow it down to these specific people rather than sending something off to contact at abc.com. Right? Okay.
John Kozicki (20:53.887)
Yup.
John Kozicki (20:58.112)
Right, yeah, and even more so if you can find out who the editor is of that department, because those are usually the people who are going to make the decisions about what gets covered. Because the journalists themselves, sometimes they’re assigned something. All right, you’re gonna go cover this. Sometimes they develop stories themselves, it varies.
John Kozicki (21:27.65)
Now from there, you want to create a media list because if this is something that you’re going to do moving forward, it’d be great if you didn’t have to go searching these websites every single time. Because for people like us, like we might have a really cool event that we’re doing and we think it’s newsworthy, you know, this month, we might not have another reason to contact the news outlets for another six months.
a year, right? So just create a little spreadsheet, name, email address, maybe website links, maybe social media links. And so that way, you know, can come back to it when you need to. So yes, you want to identify what’s newsworthy, you’re going to identify the media outlets. And then you did this, you can create your pitch.
Mandy York (21:57.763)
Yeah. Yes.
Mandy York (22:12.908)
smart.
John Kozicki (22:25.942)
Do you remember what you did when you got that coverage? Like what the headline was or anything like that for your press release?
Mandy York (22:36.3)
I don’t, I didn’t, you know, and I didn’t, I’m sure I have it somewhere. I don’t remember the headline, but it was just, I really played up the fact that we were, you know, bridging generations and bringing the kids into the community. You know, I knew what I was going for and I focused in on those details. Right? Yeah, my hook.
John Kozicki (22:53.868)
There you go.
John Kozicki (22:58.711)
Yeah.
Yeah, that’s your hook, right? That’s why someone would read it. Like what is interesting about it? So it’s not just Miss Mandy’s music classes. It’s Miss Mandy who works with these toddlers and their caregivers, and then they’re gonna go perform at the senior center. like you said, you’re bridging these multiple generations with this event.
Yeah, that’s the hook. Exactly. Then you want to get into like what makes a good press release. I’m not going to get into all of that stuff because that’s like the nuts and bolts, right? But the the general what I want to get across with this is make it as easy as possible for these journalists to basically read your press release.
understand why it’s a good story and decide, yep, this is great. You don’t want to leave them with other questions. They might have other questions, but you want to anticipate as much as possible. that way, like, look, best case scenario, I remember the first when I was working in PR, the first time one of my press releases was printed in the newspaper word for word. And I was like, wait, they do that?
Mandy York (24:29.844)
Yeah.
John Kozicki (24:31.074)
So I had written the press release, it got to the journalist or the editor, I don’t remember, and they just copy paste ran it. And so in my mind, I was like, oh, okay, that was a learning experience for me. That was that was me realizing, like, I see, if I just write the article for them, then they’re more likely to they’re more likely to print it. Right. So
Mandy York (24:56.078)
Sure. Yeah.
John Kozicki (24:59.618)
And I don’t expect us business owners and studio owners to be able to think like a journalist and write a newspaper article, but we can get close. So anticipate.
Mandy York (25:11.862)
And you know, there are a lot of resources out there too. Like I know professional groups that I’m in, they talk about this a lot and they give tips and there’s, there’s places you can go on how to write a great press release. Do that.
John Kozicki (25:22.56)
Yes. Right. So research the format of a good press release so that when it when it comes across through email or whatever, it looks like what they’re expecting to see. You know, it looks professional. Way back in my day, the resource that that I used was the public relations writers handbook.
Mandy York (25:37.656)
Yeah.
John Kozicki (25:50.37)
I still have it. Be honest, I would expect like it probably if it hasn’t been updated, it probably would need an update at this point because I know. I want to say there probably wasn’t much info about blogs and like social media in there because that stuff just didn’t exist. But I would say like look for some good resources for that. Again, you want to basically do as much work for the reporter or the journalist as possible.
John Kozicki (26:21.234)
use right up a good boilerplate. Now a boilerplate, do know what a boilerplate is in for press release? It’s basically your, it’s basically like you’re about us. It’s like maybe a paragraph that you put at the end of your press release. That’s kind of like the nuts and bolts of your business. What you do, where you’re located, if you’ve won any awards, you want to cram that stuff in the boilerplate so that it doesn’t take up space.
Mandy York (26:25.998)
No. Tell me.
John Kozicki (26:50.174)
in the actual press release in the article, right? You want to put all the good information about your hook and your pitch in the press release, all the nuts and bolts stuff. Yes, they’re going to want to know it, but that’s what a boilerplate is. It’s almost like a bio. And you might even want to write a bio for yourself as the studio owner, just as like additional, right? Let’s see.
Mandy York (27:07.799)
Yes, yeah.
John Kozicki (27:18.23)
What else, what else? last one when it comes to your pitch.
If you are sending photos, if you’re sending any sort of media videos, again, you want to do the work for for these journalists. If you provide them with great photos that they can print or publish or put online, they’re going to they’re going to be more inclined to use the photos that you provide versus if they feel like.
they need something, then have to come back to you and say, hey, do you have any pictures of this? avoid that back and forth. We did a whole episode about great photos and hiring professional photographers for your studio. This is a perfect example of why having those can be useful.
Mandy York (28:04.087)
Mm-hmm.
Mandy York (28:15.468)
Yes. And as you say that, I’m thinking heaven forbid they would use like a stock photo. You don’t want that. Right. Have great photos. Get ahead of that. That’s good advice.
John Kozicki (28:21.056)
Right.
John Kozicki (28:25.322)
Yeah, or like in your case, you did these classes. If you had photos from doing those classes previously, how great would that be if you had a photo of, you know, a two year old with their parent and then one of the seniors at the senior center and then you’re in the background, you know, that’s the kind of stuff that enhances the story when they have that visual.
Mandy York (28:47.468)
Yeah.
John Kozicki (28:55.403)
Yeah. All right. Questions about press releases.
Mandy York (28:55.917)
Yeah, all right.
Mandy York (29:00.374)
Okay, that was really helpful.
How, like, do I need to be the squeaky wheel? Cause what if I don’t get a response? Right? Cause I imagine that happens pretty frequently, wouldn’t it? I mean, I only heard back from one person. I mean, not that I threw out a really wide net. I just heard back from one person. it was, should I be worried about like becoming annoying with my press releases or any advice on that?
John Kozicki (29:12.577)
Mm-hmm.
John Kozicki (29:31.279)
I would say don’t take it personally if you don’t get a response. I think it’s okay to follow up. Be respectful. Whoever you’re sending this to, they have their job that they have to do. again, it might not be personal, but they just might read your press release and might decide like, yeah, not right now. We’ve got other stuff that we’ve got to run.
Mandy York (29:36.344)
Sure.
John Kozicki (30:03.169)
Or they might read it and say like, this is a good story, but we can’t right now. Follow up with an email, follow up with if you got phone call or a phone number, follow up with a phone call. Again, just kind of be respectful, offer value, right? So if you’re presenting something good, if you’re presenting value to them, that’s a positive.
but just don’t expect like, I wrote a press release. Now all these newspapers are now these outlets are going to print my story. they get a lot, you know, they get a lot of stuff. I think you can be persistent, but again, keep it relevant to whatever, whatever’s going on, right? If, if you’re berating people with stuff that’s not newsworthy, well, then yeah, chances are.
they see the same stuff over and over again, I’m gonna be interested, you know? So, takes time, takes a little patience. But I thought, know, if anyone does have big events, and I don’t mean like your end of session concerts like we do, you know, your recitals, not necessarily newsworthy, but something, you know,
Mandy York (31:25.794)
Yeah.
John Kozicki (31:30.069)
bigger or out of the ordinary would be more newsworthy.
Mandy York (31:32.728)
Sure. Yep. Again, that like, that benefit concert where you’re inviting the entire community in.
John Kozicki (31:40.543)
Yeah, or raising money for some sort of charity, right? That’s always a hook too. But yeah, I think relationships are, when you’re considering this, you’re building your network, you’re building relationships just like with anything. If you, okay, so think about this, or if you are trying to present yourself as an authority on a specific subject, right?
Mandy York (31:44.386)
Yeah.
John Kozicki (32:11.425)
Well, then you’re developing that relationship with these journalists and they may think of you again in the future for certain things. This makes me think of our friend Michael Hemsworth, who was on the podcast. I wish I could remember that the episode 40 something and he wrote his book. Right. And that was, I know he got on some local television stations for, for that book. So in that instance,
Michael’s presenting himself as an expert in learning and working with kids and parents. And that’s what his book was about. So play the long game, right? It’s not just about like this one time thing, but try and develop these relationships so that you can utilize them in the future when stuff does come.
Mandy York (33:01.166)
Great. Yeah, smart. Okay.
John Kozicki (33:06.517)
All right, those are my like four big points. Other questions or specifics from you and are you ready to start utilizing press releases in your marketing now?
Mandy York (33:07.022)
Hmm.
Mandy York (33:17.632)
Yeah, well, you can see my face. My wheels are turning. Yeah. I’m like, this is something maybe not enough of us utilize. You know, I think my next big thing, I should do something like this. I need to. And maybe I’ll come to you, John, to read my draft. Yeah. Cool.
John Kozicki (33:29.281)
Yeah
John Kozicki (33:36.449)
All right. Okay, I’m down. I’ll do it. I’ll do it. Okay, well then we will wrap this episode of Rock School Proprietor podcast and we’ll talk next time. See you Mandy.
Mandy York (33:49.198)
All right. See ya. Thanks, Jen.
